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  1. #1

    Savage Worlds reach attribute

    I get asked questions about the Savage Worlds reach attribute a lot on discord. Now I have been asked to post it all here...

    The reach number in FG only controls a visual help tool. It has no automated effects. The default value is Reach 1 in FG. Which draws a 1" shadow around a token. So you can easily tell if someone is within 1" range of a token. The tool has be called reach in every core rules since the early D&D 3.5 days. In the SW game rules most weapons also have a Reach attribute. The default value is 0. When you convert anything to FG add 1 to the reach.

    If everyone is playing on a grid we get this. From the top. Melee range 0 (FG reach 1). Next row is Reach 1(FG reach 2). Next row Reach 2(FG reach 3)
    grid 1.jpg

    The problem is grids suck ! So we do this...
    Note I still have snap on and lets me move half squares. Row 2 now now looks like is has range of on half an inch. The rules set measures it at 2 because it rounds up. So the visual tool will confirm that it is within 1" but it is actually measured at 2" away.
    grid 2.jpg
    A range attack on row 2 is against target number of 4. Target can't parry it. Yet most people will look at this and say that looks like melee range.

    However the computer can measure it can even more close and round up.
    Row 2 is at range 1" and row 3 is now at range 2. I got this by turning off grid snap.
    grid 3.jpg

    At this point everyone should be saying that is all melee range. I don't care what the default values gives.
    In the picture above the difference in range is 0.1" and that makes all the difference to the computer but nobody else cares.

    This shows FG can measure range really well. The reach shadow is a quick measurement tool for humans.

    When coding the rules set there is fudge factor of a half inch. This easier to test if you measure raw distance.
    Fire a gun and less that 1.5" is melee range. Whilst 1.5" and over is not. So lets make a judgement call as GM's and don't sweat the small stuff.
    grid 4.jpg
    One token half in the shadow of a reach 0 weapon. Melee range. YMMV

    For fun lets do visual tricks with a swarm encounter... Reach 2 on FG measures one half inch over a MBT. Reach 3 on FG is one half inch over a LBT.
    Swarm.jpg
    If you have swarm that covers a LBT give it Reach 3 and eat players that get inside the shadow. If the players wound the swarm. Make the Reach 2 and they now fight a MBT sized swarm. You can scale a tokens using control and mouse wheel. All of this will not effect the automation one bit. It just lets you role play a different combat mechanic without too much trouble.

    OK NOW IT IS 2024....
    Since I wrote that thread the code was changed because although the answer given was correct. People just could not accept it and in some cases with older SWD settings caused even more confusion when reach gave situational combat bonuses. So in the SWADE ruleset the magic formula is now hidden. If the reach value is set at ZERO the output is Shadow 1". So a default value of ZERO on the game book. Looks like ZERO on the CT. Which really means draw a shadow 1" away. This once again has nothing to do with dice mechanics. It is a simply a visual tool.

    Right now let talk about a different subject. Dice mechanics range. It was common question that kept coming up in the forum. So I tried to write a simple guide to help people. What I didn't expect it that the post would become the design document that developers used to recode how SWADE works. For the dice mechanics measurement. The value for melee was originally 1.5. A value that most people did not have an issue with. With grid snap off if a token was 1.6 away it was ranged combat. If it was 1.5 it was melee combat. The best way to test was using ranged combat weapons. At 1.5 the target number was Parry. However RAW the value was supposed to be "adjacent". So behind the scenes code changes where made. The only side effect people should notice today. Is the default diagonal distance is one. So height measurement tool is switched off. See the link.
    Last edited by Lonewolf; February 18th, 2024 at 00:52.
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  2. #2
    Here is how you fix the Dragon in FG or any other massive creature. Big creatures have a size from the table page 179. A recent rules update gives extra reach. A Dragon in SWADE on FG has size 8. Reach 3 (Remember the extra 1") . To make it look better on the table top it is given Space 3. This due to an arbitrary rule in FG module design that says Normal size is 1. Large is 2 and huge creatures are space 3. It is good default that works out very well.
    Attachment 55094
    For rules set coding. The only number the computer cares about is Size. You change other numbers and it will just change the visual look of the table top. The actual number in Size will determine how the automated rolls work in relation to the bigger creature.
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  3. #3
    Cheers!

  4. #4
    Don't forget that you can set the range calculation on the map to "raw" distance as well. So, while the grid will be used for snapping and token placement based on size, the actual measurements will be a raw calculation multiplied by the distance multiplier.

    Regards,
    JPG

  5. #5

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Wizard View Post
    Don't forget that you can set the range calculation on the map to "raw" distance as well. So, while the grid will be used for snapping and token placement based on size, the actual measurements will be a raw calculation multiplied by the distance multiplier.

    Regards,
    JPG
    I wrote in the first post that coding can be tested by setting Raw distance.

    However the rules set does not need this to get the right answer. Getting people to accept it is another matter. The half inch fudge factor is just there for the humans. The written rules expect intergers and people move tokens by half squares with grid snap on
    Last edited by Lonewolf; November 14th, 2022 at 20:19.
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    Over 10 years on Fantasy Grounds !

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Wizard View Post
    Don't forget that you can set the range calculation on the map to "raw" distance as well. So, while the grid will be used for snapping and token placement based on size, the actual measurements will be a raw calculation multiplied by the distance multiplier.

    Regards,
    JPG
    I haven't tried it recently, but a while back, setting range calculation to raw was messing up gang-up bonus and I think at least one other range-dependent thing (maybe whether or not parry was applied to ranged attacks in melee?). Have these returned to normal functionality with raw distance on?

  8. #8
    No idea. The SW ruleset was written by others, and maintained by Ikael (whom has been only available sporadically recently).

    Regards,
    JPG

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Lonewolf View Post
    Here is how you fix the Dragon in FG or any other massive creature. Big creatures have a size from the table page 179. A recent rules update gives extra reach. A Dragon in SWADE on FG has size 8. Reach 3 (Remember the extra 1") . To make it look better on the table top it is given Space 3. This due to an arbitrary rule in FG module design that says Normal size is 1. Large is 2 and huge creatures are space 3. It is good default that works out very well.
    Attachment 55094
    For rules set coding. The only number the computer cares about is Size. You change other numbers and it will just change the visual look of the table top. The actual number in Size will determine how the automated rolls work in relation to the bigger creature.
    Can you say that again, I missed the first bit

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Jiminimonka View Post
    Can you say that again, I missed the first bit
    Here
    When you have a grasp of that the next part:

    is
    Keep going your nearly there!
    Last edited by Lonewolf; August 14th, 2023 at 21:00.
    Ultimate License holder.
    Over 10 years on Fantasy Grounds !

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