So... Kingmaker

[Trenloe]

Yes, I saw the link. Apologies if I wasn't clear. As I mentioned, I also purchase Mongoose Traveller 2e FGU books/modules, and the books that add in direct mechanics changes or new systems add those systems to FGU with the purchase of the modules directly instead of requiring the purchase of additional extensions. I am just clarifying if that is not how it works for Pathfinder 2 modules. This isn't official integration, it is a 3rd party extension. If there is an intent on eventually bringing in integration of this critical system for Kingmaker with the purchase of the module, I can wait for that. I'm not at the point yet where I actually need the kingdom tracker. That's probably a month or so down the road of my own campaign.

FG DLC that is for rulebooks can and sometimes do have some form of coding support in the ruleset or an associated extension. For adventure products (which Kingmaker is) I'd be surprised if there's more than a handful of DLC products that also provide updated ruleset code. Happy to be proved wrong, but I'd be very surprised if there's any but a very, very small amount.

There have been plenty of other Pathfinder Adventure Paths (both 1e and 2e) that have in-built mechanics which aren't programmed in Fantasy Grounds as part of the product conversion - I can't think of one that does.

There's some information from the Kingmaker converter earlier in this thread here: https://www.fantasygrounds.com/forum...l=1#post663907 (and also some comments before and after this post). I don't know if anyone's point of view has changed, but I would be surprised if there's going to be any form of integration (with or without automation) for kingdom building etc. in the Kingmaker Adventure Path product itself. This isn't an exception to the norm for adventure product conversions on FG.

[sciencephile]

There are no plans on creating a new kingdom management extension in the foreseeable future, I'm afraid.

[pheanox]

Thanks for the reply, Trenloe. I hope I didn't come across as obnoxious, I just wasn't sure of the expectation on the system integration. The clarity is appreciated, I know each game system has a bit of semi-autonomy. I also appreciate the response on my other two questions about the layers and the plans to add in the buildings for the urban grid!

[Trenloe]

Thanks for the reply, Trenloe. I hope I didn't come across as obnoxious, I just wasn't sure of the expectation on the system integration.

No worries. We all have expectations based off our experiences, and I'd love a full-wizz-bang-integration-and-automation solution for Kingmaker stuff but that's just not realistic in an adventure product.

[dsaraujo]

Do we use dsaraujo's extension until a new one is created that has data, calculations, and building grids? Is the current state of dsaraujo's extension considered complete? Who/what is the end game for Kingdom Management.

My plan is not to do any major updates on the extension, as adding automation is a lot of work, and tomeric's spreadsheet is very functional (my plan is to use the spreadsheet myself). Like my GM enhancement extension, I usually build things for my own use, and my main goal with Kingdom Management was to store basic values so it would be nice to have players doing checks in FG. I'm planning to use simple images with building as tiles with the grid on the background for settlements (plus the settlement entry). Once I start my Kingmaker campaign and reach level 4-5, maybe I'll get back to it and add more details: as usual, I'm definitely open for feedback and suggestions here.

[SweegyLeo]

Not sure how helpful or relevant...
Partially, I'm not sure how player placed tokens are saved on a map, after.
But.
Hypothetically, if the settlement upgrades, were loaded similarly to spell tokens.
Our players can manipulate their spell tokens on a battlemap.
Theoretically, that means that a player could manipulate settlement tokens (using spell tokens) and place them onto the urban grid (battlemap)

That seems like it would be functional if not automated.
Grid snap would theoretically also help snap the tokens into the urban grid?

But I'm not sure how permanent those placements would be.
I'm new to the DM side in FG.

[sciencephile]

The buildings were placed as images instead of tokens on purpose as it was a lot more difficult to use them as tokens, due to sizing issues. Tokens are generally associated with NPCs, which have a size entry in the stat blocks that controls the size of tokens.

Using them as layers requires the GM to be involved more in taking directions from the players where to place the buildings but with the use of pointers, it should be fairly minimal effort. This method also allows the images to be locked in place so it eliminates any possibility of accidental removal of tokens.

[SweegyLeo]

The buildings were placed as images instead of tokens on purpose as it was a lot more difficult to use them as tokens, due to sizing issues. Tokens are generally associated with NPCs, which have a size entry in the stat blocks that controls the size of tokens.

Using them as layers requires the GM to be involved more in taking directions from the players where to place the buildings but with the use of pointers, it should be fairly minimal effort. This method also allows the images to be locked in place so it eliminates any possibility of accidental removal of tokens.

That makes a ton of sense.
And as you said, pointers can be drawn as squares, that can be sized to fit the grid anyway right.. And then moved into position, and multiple players could suggest with their pointers.

And I like that Layers solution for placement.
From experience under our DM, she is preety smooth with her layers. I can see that working really well.

Thank you.

[sgtwhy]

The (kingmaker AP in general) is something I've spent countless hours on both as a player and (multiple times now) managing it as a GM.
The old system was challenging enough to manage, with all of the various pieces of metadata. But this new updated version is more complex in so many ways.

Plus, it’s not even until the third book/chapter that kingdoms even come into play ... so many Kingmaker campaigns will never make it that far. (speaking from personal experience)
And it’s not until even later that “armies” come into context.(that's possibly years of regular playing!)

But anyhow, my point was - I'm excited about Kingmaker and about automating it where possible … if even just for my own needs as a GM (if for some reason it's not possible to share my work as an extension?)

I spent the last month on a “deep dive” into LUA + FGU code ... as well as countless hours pouring over the mechanics related to this updated system.
Currently, I have a fully working “kingdom sheet” written from the ground up using CORE RPG … to intentionally keep it compatible with PF1, PF2 and 5e.

It works the same for any of those versions, without depending on their rulesets.

From there, I started on designing “kingdom turn” automation as the next challenge … and have a rough system in place already, that I will be play-testing with my group.

Perhaps, if it doesn't conflict with any "already promised" releases from Smiteworks, etc ... I can eventually make this "alternate" option available for others as well.

[sgtwhy]

I had mentioned its possible to use the building icons to create a city urban map, but afterwards realized it has the same issue with tokens resizing.

It now makes sense, why you decided to instead treat them as images ... so the size remains constant after a reload.

(removed the attachment to avoid confusion / spoilers)