STAR TREK 2d20
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  1. #11
    I agree that distance should be used and not grid.

  2. #12
    Just pushed a new update to the Test/beta channel to change the Gang Up calc to use <= 1.5 (instead of <= 1); which should give expected behavior even if house rule diagonal distance set to 1.5 or Raw and still using a grid.

    Regards,
    JPG

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Wizard View Post
    Just pushed a new update to the Test/beta channel to change the Gang Up calc to use <= 1.5 (instead of <= 1); which should give expected behavior even if house rule diagonal distance set to 1.5 or Raw and still using a grid.

    Regards,
    JPG
    That is much better I think now. It makes it easier for people that are trying to avoid the grid limitations.

    With SWADE based rulesets. Expect people to still ask for Gang Up calc with a hex grid and no snap. They hate any type of grids.
    Another odd ball thing is people might still complain that a Reach 1 weapon (which is actually Reach 2 on FG) does not get factored in. Since reach code is only for a graphics overlay.

    Gang Up is simple rule to work out but putting it in FG can be troublesome. Changing calc to <= 1.5 (instead of <= 1) might help out a lot.
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  4. #14
    I'll leave the complicated issues to deal with Reach weapons to @Ikael. I was going for focusing on the general issue related to the new option.

    Regards,
    JPG

  5. #15

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    Thank you!

    I, and those in my group, don't care for the grid limitations, and dislike hexes, mostly because the positioning and movement is weird (if you move within hexes, and if you don't, why have them). An inch is an inch, and shouldn't matter what pattern is drawn over a map, and shouldn't be different because you're not moving or measuring in a cardinal direction. If we're going to use geometric patterns, why don't we use octagons? Don't they make more sense for minis on maps? They cover straight and diagonals equally well. I want an octagon option!

    Though there is something to be said for gamification and making it clear where everyone is standing and what their personal space is. Sometimes it's nice to make it clear at a glance. We've effectively been moving and standing in 6 ft squares for the last couple of years. Maybe putting grids on streets and floors would have helped.

  6. #16
    In test mode 14 March 16:24 UTC
    I realized yet another edge case where things can go wrong. Everyone hates grids in SWADE.... unless there are in a dogfight chase. So I when back to run the tests on that part again.
    This time the approach to measurement is the opposite attitude to grids. Here the grid is mandatory and a there is no diagonal measurements allowed. So we use a special chase mode function to set the grid up. This triggered by placing cards onto a normal grid and there is a UI button on the map. Right click to switch on card
    boundary overlay. To keep it simple we leave squares to 1. Therfore a card distance should now work out as 3.

    First test got range check.PNG

    Now I have not touched the new map diagonal distance option. Diagonal measurements don't exist in chase mode. Answer expected was 6" I think. Anyone else?
    Last edited by Lonewolf; March 14th, 2022 at 17:40.
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  7. #17
    I'll have to leave that one for @Ikael. I'm not familiar enough with how chases should work.

    Regards,
    JPG

  8. #18
    Back in live branch. Here is an expected correct answer. If we want a card range of 15. Squares must be 5. The measurement will be 15 per card in any direction.
    unknown.png
    I am rushing out the door for some real life adventuring. When available again I will have another look at the same set up on test branch.

    I am really hope that I am barking up the wrong tree here and get the same result.
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  9. #19
    I'd have to see the campaign data to see what might be happening in that first image.

    The distance between each card is the base "chase" units (i.e. 3 in your picture); and that is multiplied by the grid distance in the image data panel settings. Then, the closest chase card is determined for each token in order to do the calculation.

    Here is my image of what I tried attached to this post. I tried playing with the campaign setting and raw distance toggle in the image panel; but neither affected the calculation for me.

    Regards,
    JPG
    Attached Images Attached Images

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Wizard View Post
    I'd have to see the campaign data to see what might be happening in that first image.

    The distance between each card is the base "chase" units (i.e. 3 in your picture); and that is multiplied by the grid distance in the image data panel settings. Then, the closest chase card is determined for each token in order to do the calculation.

    Here is my image of what I tried attached to this post. I tried playing with the campaign setting and raw distance toggle in the image panel; but neither affected the calculation for me.

    Regards,
    JPG
    Your test is not right but it's ok. Neither was mine Having run through a whole lot more tests things are looking very good. Well done.

    For a good test. When placing cards they must be either adjacent for a chase. Or seperated by exactly two spaces in a dog fight. There is a button at the top of the map that needs lit too.
    Right click and turn on card highlight.

    Now the diagonal measurement should be replaced with correct values and any tools used for it deactivated. In a chase when the cards are adjacent there is only (square = Card Distance). Diagonal measurement never happens as the chase is a one dimensional.
    With a Dog fight. The chase is a two dimensional but vehicles still move and count Range orthogonally (no diagonals). The cards are therfore (square * 3 = Card Distance). Each 9 sqares covered by a card are one unit of measurement for the ruleset.

    I know people will come back and say it is not a perfect solution but it works. Common user error is to try and duplicate the exact values from a rule book. For example if they want a copy the value of 25 in the book. They try and set square distance to 8.33 instead of using an interger like 8. It is good practice to set the card values slightly less that normal anyway. Since rest of the calculations favor it when working out range bands. If they display raw distance with a non interger they should expect some odd values to come out.

    Right now I think chase mode will carry on ignoring any options for diagonal measurement. Therfore so far it is working
    Last edited by Lonewolf; March 17th, 2022 at 09:45.
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