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  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnD View Post
    Hmm... well you could just always change what Darkvision means in your game.
    Lol, in Italy all people are RULE LAWYERS basically.

    They would never accept such a change of the rule.

    But I think they could accept different POINTS for point buy or better rolling methods for humans.
    Neuronblaster GM on warhorn.net

  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by *Neuro* View Post
    Lol, in Italy all people are RULE LAWYERS basically.

    They would never accept such a change of the rule.

    But I think they could accept different POINTS for point buy or better rolling methods for humans.
    With Darkvision they can only see in gray. Color code the caves and dungeons and have the traps be different colors. They will always be carrying a torch with them there after. Also, perception checks with darkvision is at a disadvantage.

    Very early on, you might have one of the traps be deadly and kill a PC or two. This would get them to switch to a human variant with the added benefits you are suggesting.

  3. #13
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    Darkvision results in disadvantage on perception checks. You can make that mean more in your game if you are dungeon delving.

    Note most discussions of the human variant in 5E tend to state that they are the most powerful race, at least at low-levels given things like immediate access to GWM/PAM. Personally, I've considered eliminating the variant choice in my campaigns because of this.

    but do what works in your game

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  4. #14
    Of all the options i think +1 to four stats and a feat is pretty wicked. Would i use it? Probably. I can see it being pretty fun because i think the variant human is good but lacking a little something.

  5. #15
    Tables tend to have group think. It looks as the OP's party values darkvision above feats. Other tables differ. It's hard to know who's right. In my opinion, darkvision is very nice, if everyone has it. If not, the group will still need lights. Scouting is easier with darkvision, but in FGU you'll notice that line of sight is very important as well. You cannot look around corners.

    In my world the race of PC is more than a gimmick, it defines how the world reacts and his/her place in society quite a bit. Is your world reacting differently to dwarves than elves, and are the players embracing their elfiness? Or is everyone just playing numbers?

    Variant human is considered to be one of the stronger options. Be careful in boosting it.
    Last edited by Milmoor; May 11th, 2021 at 21:26.

  6. #16
    My PCs have a favorite method of neutralizing the dark vision of their opponents. They cast a light spell on a crossbow bolt (sometimes an arrow) and shoot it into one of their opponents. This has the effect of neutralizing dark vision in the proximity of the opponents and leaving the party in the shadows. Since light is a cantrip in 5e it is limited by ammunition. It is a very effective tactic. You could use it against the party assuming that denizens of the under dark would have developed anti-darkvision tactics over the ages.

    Additionally, you could give out magic weapons and armor that radiate a dim light. Choice, magic item or darkvision is generally a no brainer. The justification for illuminated weapons is all over the place. If you are feeling particularly evil you could give a weapon that glows only in the presence of an enemy.

    Another idea is to run games with a lot of stuff on the surface and small 6-10 room underground areas some of which have their own lighting. The less darkvision is needed the more players will wish they had the extra feat. If you think about the Hobbit, 75% or more of the book was surface adventure, the exception being the goblin caves and the Lonely Mountain.

    There are all sorts of options to make darkvision less if you want to.

  7. #17

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    Personally I think your players are overvaluing darkvision. The -5 (disadvantage) on perception all the time is asking to be ambushed and surprised a *lot* in dungeons.

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Milmoor View Post

    In my world the race of PC is more than a gimmick, it defines how the world reacts and his/her place in society quite a bit. Is your world reacting differently to dwarves than elves, and are the players embracing their elfiness? Or is everyone just playing numbers?

    Variant human is considered to be one of the stronger options. Be careful in boosting it.
    My players are quote powerplayers and just chose elf race because of the stats. I have a party of 5 of which 4 elves and 1 half-elf (paladin.... ).

    I don't think that a +1/+1 and feat is on par with an half elf or elf for the benefits they have.

    Elves and half elves are far superior.
    Neuronblaster GM on warhorn.net

  9. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Griogre View Post
    Personally I think your players are overvaluing darkvision. The -5 (disadvantage) on perception all the time is asking to be ambushed and surprised a *lot* in dungeons.
    Darkvision is a BEAST, especially if all the characters have it.

    I did not remember about the quality of darkvision, it is important that I remember that darkvision means dim light and what you say above.

    But even with these limitations, my players would have not chosen the human variant as is, other races are far superior, unless you want to make a special build.


    I haven't decided yet, but I would like some sort of human centric game with the exception of maybe 1 non human.


    I am playing since 2016, 5e is good but could be bettere, race wise. What I think is that in the future they will ruin everything as we are under the "politically correct" dictator ship, is everywhere now.

    They will make races all the same and, if possible, humans the worst ones.

    So i foresee the humans would be even worse in 6th edition D&D.

    I hope not, but media pressure on Hasbro could be fatal on this.

    Neuronblaster GM on warhorn.net

  10. #20
    I respectfully disagree. It's not the humans, it's the table, GM and players. Sure, some exotic races are better in certain circumstances, but on average, variant humans are rather good. If all the dungeons have low ceilings, everyone will play a small race. What is the standing of elves in your society? Do you have combats in plain sight, etc. Try to vary both combat and social circumstances, and other races will be a valid choice as well.

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