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  1. #1

    Slow dice rolls in Symbaroum

    Summary:
    I have been DMing for the same group of players for over a year, with no previous issues. We recently switched to playing Symbaroum again, and two of my 3 players now have very slow (~30 seconds) dice rolls, while the 3rd player is totally fine. We have all updated to latest version, clearing caches etc with no joy. It works fine when we switched to Alien or D&D 5e, but when switched back to Symbaroum exactly the same thing is happening.

    The speed of rolls gets progressively slower for the 2 effected players (Craig and Steve in log files attached) while Ian is fine

    I let Ian take control of Steve's character and he could roll from his character with no issues, while Steve taking control of Ian's character exhibited the problem - ruling out anything re the character (I think)

    Very grateful of any help. Prepared to believe it might be something I've done somewhere, but strange that the problem only occurs in Symbaroum and not D&D 5e and Alien

    Log Files
    Log files attached for me (Andy, the GM), Ian (no issues / dice rolls fine), Craig and Steve (both with the slow dice roll issue)

    Ruleset(s):
    Symbaroum

    New Campaign / FGC Migrated Campaign:
    Using a new campaign build in FGU, although characters were imported from Classic ages ago

    Extensions/Themes:
    None.

    Modules Loaded:
    Chronicles of the Copper Crown, Symbaroum Core rulebook, Symbaroum Core rulebook (Players guide), The Promised Land, FG Battle maps

    Operating System / Language Setting:
    Microsoft Windows 10 Home, 64 bit. English language

    Steps to Reproduce:
    1) I start up FGU, running in cloud mode, and start Symbaroum campaign
    2) Players join
    3) Players roll a dice from their character sheets (say Quickness, Vigilance etc)
    4) 2 of players have very slow response, 3rd is fine (so I guess this will be hard to repeat!)
    5) Fruity swearing then usually kicks in about now!
    Attached Files Attached Files

  2. #2
    I was noticing the same thing today with CoreRPG. I thought it was my code, but then I just tried "/die 6d10s6". It is not every time, but every now and then it takes a bit to run. I then jumped out of my ruleset and just CoreRPG and was able to duplicate it.

  3. #3
    Nothing has been changed in that part of the code for a while; and I didn't see anything program-related in the logs provided.

    @agoldsmi55,
    I'm wondering if there might be some sort of overhead in the Symbaroum ruleset that would cause this. Can you provide your campaign?

    @frostbyte000jm,
    I'm not seeing this at all in the CoreRPG ruleset running the "/die 6d10s6" command. I put on hot key and threw 10 on host, then 10 on player, with no slow downs. Can you recreate at all?

    Regards,
    JPG

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by agoldsmi55 View Post
    Summary:
    I have been DMing for the same group of players for over a year, with no previous issues. We recently switched to playing Symbaroum again, and two of my 3 players now have very slow (~30 seconds) dice rolls, while the 3rd player is totally fine. We have all updated to latest version, clearing caches etc with no joy. It works fine when we switched to Alien or D&D 5e, but when switched back to Symbaroum exactly the same thing is happening.

    The speed of rolls gets progressively slower for the 2 effected players (Craig and Steve in log files attached) while Ian is fine

    I let Ian take control of Steve's character and he could roll from his character with no issues, while Steve taking control of Ian's character exhibited the problem - ruling out anything re the character (I think)

    Very grateful of any help. Prepared to believe it might be something I've done somewhere, but strange that the problem only occurs in Symbaroum and not D&D 5e and Alien

    Log Files
    Log files attached for me (Andy, the GM), Ian (no issues / dice rolls fine), Craig and Steve (both with the slow dice roll issue)

    Ruleset(s):
    Symbaroum

    New Campaign / FGC Migrated Campaign:
    Using a new campaign build in FGU, although characters were imported from Classic ages ago

    Extensions/Themes:
    None.

    Modules Loaded:
    Chronicles of the Copper Crown, Symbaroum Core rulebook, Symbaroum Core rulebook (Players guide), The Promised Land, FG Battle maps

    Operating System / Language Setting:
    Microsoft Windows 10 Home, 64 bit. English language

    Steps to Reproduce:
    1) I start up FGU, running in cloud mode, and start Symbaroum campaign
    2) Players join
    3) Players roll a dice from their character sheets (say Quickness, Vigilance etc)
    4) 2 of players have very slow response, 3rd is fine (so I guess this will be hard to repeat!)
    5) Fruity swearing then usually kicks in about now!
    Any chance you or your players might be having bandwidth or memory issues? background programs, and wireless devices tend to make FG slower and sluggish. Also, the initial joininging or downloading of new content for your players, or perhaps large pictures and/or maps can make memory problems too.
    FGC (Fantasy Grounds College) Founder
    DnD5e DM
    FG teacher and student!
    Ultimate License Holder
    Discord Alias: Laerun
    FGC Team Member
    http://www.fantasygroundscollege.net

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Wizard View Post
    Nothing has been changed in that part of the code for a while; and I didn't see anything program-related in the logs provided.

    @agoldsmi55,
    I'm wondering if there might be some sort of overhead in the Symbaroum ruleset that would cause this. Can you provide your campaign?

    @frostbyte000jm,
    I'm not seeing this at all in the CoreRPG ruleset running the "/die 6d10s6" command. I put on hot key and threw 10 on host, then 10 on player, with no slow downs. Can you recreate at all?

    Regards,
    JPG
    I will try and record it. It wasnt nearly the lag that happened in my project, but it was there. It was maybe 5 second lag after the dice stopped and the amount showed, but not every time.

    But in my project it was like 10-15 seconds.

    I am doing a bit, but nothing crazy with my rolls, and today was my first day seeing it. So maybe it was something weird going on around 6ish EST.

  6. #6
    I have now tried rolling a hundred times. I can no longer reproduce it in my ruleset or core. This is frustrating. I have the exact same stuff running on my machine I had running before. I have gigabit internet so that is most likely not the culprit. idk.

    My ruleset is built on Core, and there isn't much to it yet. I was also able to reproduce in core, but where in my ruleset the lag was about 15ish seconds, Core was about 10ish. So I jumped on here and saw someone else report.

    If I can get it to happen again, I will video it and send it. Hopefully it was just a fluke.

  7. #7
    I doubt if it has anything to do with Internet. When I've seen any stuttering in dice or token movement, it's usually indicative of some sort of "load" elsewhere in the program. So, it is most likely related to other windows you have open (lists, images, etc.); and possibly what scripts the ruleset is running in the background.

    Next time you see it, take a screenshot of the whole screen; then close windows one by one to see if you can narrow down the culprit.

    Regards,
    JPG

  8. #8
    Thanks for your comments / thoughts.

    To rule out my campaign (home grown import of Wrath of the Warden, from pdf version I bought from DriveThru), I created a brand new Campaign, and only loaded the ruleset and Chronicle of the Copper crown. I then imported my player's characters and we reproduced the same behaviour last night)

    I have some more tests to do tonight with the players, as we rule out different theories, but we have tried the following in addition to my initial cry for help

    1) The players experiencing the problem rolling from character sheets can still roll dice from bottom left stack of dice with no issues
    2) We created new characters and re-entered the characters stats etc, and dice rolls ran fine (from the character sheet, e.g. Vigilance check)
    3) However, when we copied equipment from inventory of old sheet to new sheet, the fun started again (very slow dice rolls, 30 seconds +)
    4) I then noticed that the players had equipment I had dragged onto their character sheets when we played Chronicles of the Copper Crown last year. When I deleted these and replaced them with new items / manually entered item details all seemed to work fine
    (This may be a coincidence - we are testing further tonight, by rolling a fixed number of dice rolls *without* and inventory items from purchased module, and then roll same number of dice rolls once I've dragged an item across onto inventory.). This may be a red herring, but it keeps us out of mischief!).

    If I can reproduce the issue tonight after test at #4, I will post a copy of an exported character that causes the issue and a subtle variant that is fine (but I've been wrong before [January 1989, if you are wondering], so will see how it goes) :-) .... I will also attached a screen grab of the whole screen, but I think your comments (Moon Wizard) above were for Frostbyte

    We all have at least 16GB of memory, 3 of us have 200Mb/s fibre broadband (although one of the people experiencing the issue only has 6Mb/s, I assume over string and tin-cans), and we all have 16GB or greater memory, as well as reasonable graphics cards.

    p.s.: Well aware of the need to keep images / maps relatively small file size, and have been fairly ruthless on file sizes on my campaign, but as I say, can reproduce the behaviour in a 'clean' campaign only using purchased adventure
    Last edited by agoldsmi55; May 8th, 2021 at 15:45.

  9. #9
    @agoldsmi55,

    Correct, some of the discussion was related but not applicable to your original post. This is why I usually prefer each person to start their own independent thread for any issues; though occasionally there are similarities.

    Based on your excellent sleuthing, it sounds like the problematic older items are causing some sort of network looping that is bogging down the system. This is usually related to problematic ruleset code which constantly changes a value endlessly while open; but I'd have to get a campaign with a copy of problematic character to investigate. Does it still happen if you import one of the characters with the old data into a new campaign? (You may be able to pull an old database session file out of your campaign directory before you made the item changes, if you already cleaned up items.)

    Regards,
    JPG

  10. #10
    Get someone on a really high latency internet connection, such as satellite internet, and you will see every dice roll is amazingly slow. It's pretty comical really.

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