Super Secret Sneak Preview of Lighting and Vision - Shhhh, don't tell Carl and John

[kevininrussia]

Doing that would require a lot more work than you realize (which is why it's probably not done now) and tying the two visibilities together is just more burden on player/host network updates. So I have to totally disagree - with your total disagreement

Unless they can do it with minimal debugging burden impact (effort) and that it does not cross over multiple rulesets needing to be tweaked. Really - effort and reliability is what I object to about this.

So what's the point of seeing the token on the map as shown in the video if its invisible on the Combat Tracker?

Currently I always turn on Mask Sensitive Visibility on tokens which from watching the video will become default (good). So when a token becomes visible on the map, I don't get why one would not want it visible on the CT. Everybody can see it on the map so what's the problem? :-) I can understand is some cases if the token is invisible in game as a condition it should not be seen by LOS.

[Jiminimonka]

Hey I'm all for it. Just watched all the tutorials. Super excited to see this feature soon. Hopefully it won't cause to many issues with all the extensions we already have lol

The extension people are going to be working on it immediately so it wont be a long term issue.

[SilentRuin]

So what's the point of seeing the token on the map as shown in the video if its invisible on the Combat Tracker?

Currently I always turn on Mask Sensitive Visibility on tokens which from watching the video will become default (good). So when a token becomes visible on the map, I don't get why one would not want it visible on the CT. Everybody can see it on the map so what's the problem? :-) I can understand is some cases if the token is invisible in game as a condition it should not be seen by LOS.

It seems no different than the current LOS correct? If I move a token and it's not visible in CT and it does not become visible on map - how is this different?

What I'm saying is the new lighting does not effect this logic at all. It currently behaves this way - I see no reason when they drop lighting into the mix why it would not STILL behave this way. If the CT has it marked invisible - it will stay invisible. If its marked visible - it will only become visible on map if they are in range. Is that not the way it works today?

The control on visibility on map is controlled by CT in most normal cases. You are suggesting that this no longer be allowed. That if I set a CT entry to invisible - that too bad so sad - you moved in range of him and now its flipped back to visible?

Me thinks you do not know what you are really asking for. How will I make something visible to me on map and CT but not on players map or CT? Your suggestion would be - no - you can never do that.

That is not a solution. What you are suggesting is not a solution. You'd need something new - a whole new flavor of CT/map visibility. Which is not what your suggesting.

Hence, I disagree with doing it.

[kevininrussia]

Example:
A player walks around the corner and because Mask Sensitive Visibility is turned on they immediately see the orc hiding. Exciting! The player then shoots it with an arrow. They dont see anything on the CT or the Chat Box of their attack. Oops, hold on I say. Let me look for that Orc Savage 6 and turn its visibility on the CT. Hold on... looking.... looking... lame

Combat Encounter:

[Trenloe]

A player walks around the corner...

I thought that was the start of a joke!

[kevininrussia]

It seems no different than the current LOS correct? If I move a token and it's not visible in CT and it does not become visible on map - how is this different?

What I'm saying is the new lighting does not effect this logic at all. It currently behaves this way - I see no reason when they drop lighting into the mix why it would not STILL behave this way. If the CT has it marked invisible - it will stay invisible. If its marked visible - it will only become visible on map if they are in range. Is that not the way it works today?

The control on visibility on map is controlled by CT in most normal cases. You are suggesting that this no longer be allowed. That if I set a CT entry to invisible - that too bad so sad - you moved in range of him and now its flipped back to visible?

Me thinks you do not know what you are really asking for. How will I make something visible to me on map and CT but not on players map or CT? Your suggestion would be - no - you can never do that.

That is not a solution. What you are suggesting is not a solution. You'd need something new - a whole new flavor of CT/map visibility. Which is not what your suggesting.

Hence, I disagree with doing it.

Mask Sensitive Visibility. Its a token option.

[SilentRuin]

Example:
A player walks around the corner and because Mask Sensitive Visibility is turned on they immediately see the orc hiding. Exciting! The player then shoots it with an arrow. They dont see anything on the CT or the Chat Box of their attack. Oops, hold on I say. Let me look for that Orc Savage 6 and turn its visibility on the CT. Hold on... looking.... looking... lame

I wonder if you read anything I actually wrote in my last reply. I set your Orc Savage 10 to invisible in CT because he has a ring of invisibility - or has successfully hidden under a table or something. You come in range - POOF - he's visible.
I raise your lame and call DOUBLE LAME.

Yes, I know what Mask Sensitive Visibility is - had tons of issues with it in extensions and had it fixed recently in documents.

[SilentRuin]

(added because this disagreement seems more hostile in text than it should be - we just disagree).

[kevininrussia]

I wonder if you read anything I actually wrote in my last reply. I set your Orc Savage 10 to invisible in CT because he has a ring of invisibility - or has successfully hidden under a table or something. You come in range - POOF - he's visible.
I raise your lame and call DOUBLE LAME.

So using your logic, it is more convenient to manually select the 'eye' icon on the combat tracker when tokens becomes visible on the map than turning off Mask Sensitive on the one time some NPC turns invisible.

And its a debate. :-)

[Zacchaeus]

Currently I always turn on Mask Sensitive Visibility on tokens which from watching the video will become default (good).

I don't think that's correct. A token will not be seen on the map unless it is within range of the lighting of the PC/NPC's lighting and is set to visible on the map. So if Bob the PC is in a dark room with a candle which emits light out to 20 feet then an NPC that is 30 feet away will not be visible to Bob on the map. If the NPC token is invisible on the CT then Bob can walk right past the NPC without seeing it. Only if the NPC is visible on the CT will Bob's light pick up the token when he gets close enough.