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  1. #1
    bmos's Avatar
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    Monstrous Physique Rules Question

    Any rules lawyers () want to chime in on this? I think the answer is yes, but it took a while to get all the info in one place!

    Monstrous Physique says:
    When you cast this spell, you can assume the form of any Small or Medium creature of the monstrous humanoid type. If the form you assume has any of the following abilities, you gain the listed ability: climb 30 feet, fly 30 feet (average maneuverability), swim 30 feet, darkvision 60 feet, low-light vision, and scent. If the form you assume has the aquatic subtype, you gain the aquatic and amphibious subtypes.
    The transmutation (polymorph) magic description says:
    If a polymorph spell causes you to change size, apply the size modifiers appropriately, changing your armor class, attack bonus, Combat Maneuver Bonus, and Stealth skill modifiers. Your ability scores are not modified by this change unless noted by the spell.
    Does this mean that on top of this from Monstrous Physique:
    Huge monstrous humanoid: If the form you take is that of a Huge monstrous humanoid, you gain a +6 size bonus to your Strength, a –4 penalty to your Dexterity, and a +6 natural armor bonus.
    I have to add (assuming a medium character):
    Stealth -8; Fly -4; CMB and CMD +2; ATK: -2; AC: -2

    ?
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  2. #2

    .
    yea, assuming you're using the spell from pfrpg - spellbook, only the 6/-4/6 is in the effects. fg doesn't do auto-adjust for changing from medium to huge (not that i know of... i think fg can only adjust for reach).

    you would have to put in the effects for huge size to make it follow all the rules (as you have outlined in your message).
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    Quote Originally Posted by tahl_liadon View Post

    .
    yea, assuming you're using the spell from pfrpg - spellbook, only the 6/-4/6 is in the effects. fg doesn't do auto-adjust for changing from medium to huge (not that i know of... i think fg can only adjust for reach).

    you would have to put in the effects for huge size to make it follow all the rules (as you have outlined in your message).
    Yeah, no automation I've seen in the code (although the required information is there in FG to automate it).
    It would be a fairly easy extension, but probably unnecessary since each spell's effects just have to be changed on the Actions tab once.
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  4. #4
    Hey bmos,
    I've just been researching that ... because of the post you had in the PFRPG - Spellbook post.

    From everything I have read (the rules as written and a number of forum posts from various locations) your interpretation does look to be correct.

    Daniel

  5. #5
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    Cool! To be fair, a player actually brought it to my attention (which is very honest of him because he basically just uses polymorph for bigger creatures which makes it mostly a penalty for him).
    I was pretty surprised it was so complicated, but that's Pathfinder for you

    Do you think it makes more sense to automate it as an extension or to modify the spells? The extension approach is nice because it works regardless of the spell (I can just use the size box on the combat tracker compared with the size as entered on charsheet/npc sheet) but then everyone who wants it needs to use an extension which adds complexity (so does more complex spells though!)
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  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by bmos View Post
    Cool! To be fair, a player actually brought it to my attention (which is very honest of him because he basically just uses polymorph for bigger creatures which makes it mostly a penalty for him).
    I was pretty surprised it was so complicated, but that's Pathfinder for you

    Do you think it makes more sense to automate it as an extension or to modify the spells? The extension approach is nice because it works regardless of the spell (I can just use the size box on the combat tracker compared with the size as entered on charsheet/npc sheet) but then everyone who wants it needs to use an extension which adds complexity (so does more complex spells though!)
    Each approach has its pros and cons. As much as I would like it in the spell itself I think it will get too cluttered. I like the idea of an extension, but as you said, that means that extension then has to be loaded.

    i think my initial approach is going to be to add a new page that has all the information, and effects, for size differences, and add a link to that page in all the Polymorph spell descriptions. That approach also has its own sets of cons ... mainly the fact that this is yet another window that needs to brought up. But right now that feels like the best approach to me. Of course, once I implement it and play around with it, I might find it too cumbersome and change my mind

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by dllewell View Post
    Each approach has its pros and cons. As much as I would like it in the spell itself I think it will get too cluttered. I like the idea of an extension, but as you said, that means that extension then has to be loaded.
    i think extensions are great (and i appreciate everyone who has devoted time/efforts to provide them to the community). i also agree with the statement above... however, it doesn't bother me much to load the ones that work for me. the hiccups have only been occasional bugs (that are quickly squashed!).

    modules are less troublesome, i think. i use this effects module (thx @blahness98, @callum, @archangel). it takes minimal effort to manually set it up when you want to use an effect, but it is quite useful.

    i think it's a good option for this need: @bmos, if you work with the author(s) to continue adding effects, it would continue to improve that module.
    -----
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    Quote Originally Posted by tahl_liadon View Post
    @bmos, if you work with the author(s) to continue adding effects, it would continue to improve that module.
    I was just thinking the other day that a version of the effects module that removed all the spells (since we now have dllewell's magnificent spellbook module) and just focused on utility effects like size change, combat penalties, etc would be very useful.
    My main issue I have with the effects modules right now are that there are just way too many for a simple list view to expose in a browse-able format.
    Last edited by bmos; October 8th, 2020 at 13:33.
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  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by bmos View Post
    I was just thinking the other day that a version of the effects module that removed all the spells (since we now have dllewell's magnificent spellbook) and just focused on utility effects like size change, combat penalties, etc would be very useful.
    My main issue I have with the effects modules right now are that there are just way too many for a simple list view to expose in a browse-able format.
    I have encountered the same thing. The effects module from @blahness98, @callum, @archangel is awesome, but I have stopped using it because their are just so many entries in it that I find it difficult to quickly find the specific one I want. I know you can search and filter the list to find what you need but it still seems a little overwhelming.

    I can take a stab at modifying the effects module to remove the spell effects and add in the size effects and any other combat effects. I should have some time this weekend to do that. Unless you were planning on doing that bmos?

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by dllewell View Post
    I have encountered the same thing. The effects module from @blahness98, @callum, @archangel is awesome, but I have stopped using it because their are just so many entries in it that I find it difficult to quickly find the specific one I want. I know you can search and filter the list to find what you need but it still seems a little overwhelming.

    I can take a stab at modifying the effects module to remove the spell effects and add in the size effects and any other combat effects. I should have some time this weekend to do that. Unless you were planning on doing that bmos?
    Go ahead! I've got a lot of diseases/poisons I need to spend time converting to xml anyway
    bmos' pathfinder 1e extensions
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