Isometric token positioning, diagonal distance calculation problems and pointers

[Claneidosyan]

Hi, lately I've been playing all my sessions with isometric maps and I can't wait to switch to FGU, since the iso grid is looking great!
I've been making some new tests with FGU lately and I wanted to share what I saw.

1) In today's (16-03-2020) release notes I saw a fix in isometric distance calculations, but I think that the diagonal distances are still wrong. I tried with all three diagonal distance calculations in the settings, but nothing changed.


Also the targeting seems really off with bigger tokens


Here I'm targeting the dragon from the player, and it creates a distance in the wrong direction



2) Right now the token scaling starts from the center of the token. Since isometric token usually have their base at the ground level and are usually bigger than just their base, when putting one on the map, it usually starts really small and you have to resize it to the correct position.
Because of their base, when resizing a token with no extra borders, since the tokens scale from the center, the resized token is usually scaled wrong:
ezgif-7-52bc681f1260.gif

Modifying the tokens to make sure that the center of the base is at the center of the image, solves this problem (all the tokens shown in the screenshots are modified with the transparent padding to make them scale precisely with the colored base on the grid), but creates new problems:


In particular there's the fact that now tokens can cover other tokens with their transparent padding, so it's more difficult to select the tokens you want to select. In FG classic to select a token you couldn't select a token when clicking on the transparent parts of the images, so making this change in FGU could solve this issue.
But there are more issues, like the positioning of effects and HP on the token.

Since the dragon is big, the transparent padding makes it even bigger, so the effect and life indicator are really far from the token (you can see them in the blue part of the map, at the lower angles of the picture), but you can see the same issue with the player tokens in the previous images.

The ideal solution could be the possibility to choose the scaling center of the tokens (as an option inside FGU to do it on the fly, or maybe a parameter to add in a xml definition for each token?), in order to avoid useless padding and to ensure correct scaling. This could be extended as a way to define properties for the tokens to function better in isometric grids (like defining the position of the whole base, so the token is automatically scaled to the correct dimension of the grid instead of using the whole image dimension and having to resize it every time).

Now I understand that this is probably not a priority, so a good solution in the mean time could be just making the transparent part of a token non selectable and for the positioning of the status and HP indicators... no idea :P


3) Pointers are still not isometric. Circles, squares and cones proportions could be linked to the proportions of the grid?


I'm attaching one of the tokens I used in the tests (with the permissions of the artist), if you want to reproduce the behaviour.

[Moon Wizard]

Thanks for reporting. We've re-opened the ticket for iso-grid measurements of pointers and targeting.

Since iso grids are not as commonly used as square (and even hex) grids, the concept of token bases being the token "position" was not envisioned. Plus, all of our assets are pog/overhead styles, which you would want centered in an iso-grid by default. I think that the ability to use iso-style tokens as well will need to be a later addition; and I envision it will be a setting that you would turn on for a map on the grid toolbar (where you set the iso-grid in the first place).

For now, we plan to look at fixing the distance calculations; but iso-style tokens won't be supported by default in the short term. I'll add it to our request list.

Regards,
JPG

[Claneidosyan]

Thank you! I know isometric is not a priority, but I appreciate the addition anyway!

Do you plan to change the token selection to the same way it works in FG classic (so that you have to click on the solid pixels of the token to select it, while the transparent pixels are ignored)?
That alone would make the isometric in FGU usable for me (with a little effort on my part to convert the tokens). Right now the fact that a token is selectable/highlighted even if you position the mouse on its transparent pixels make it difficult.

[Moon Wizard]

The transparent selection can be problematic for top-down non-pog tokens on any grid; so it's not something we're looking to re-implement on FGU. The current system works relatively well for standard tokens, even on iso grids.

We understand what you are trying to accomplish, and have added as a feature request for future versions since it's something we think would be cool and we'd like to support.

Regards,
JPG

[Foreshadowing Peanuts]

I just started getting into DIY isometric tokens with my game (though I'm still just using a flat grid map), and I was so happy to find this thread, because it spells out exactly what my problem is, and the same coping steps that I'm taking, with the same unintended consequences to token scale and distance measuring.

I understand that the developers aren't making this a priority, but I was wondering if the OP has found any workarounds on the range and token-scaling issues, or if the effects can be ameliorated in other ways.

Now that I've started down the isometric rabbit-hole, I'm reluctant to give it up, because it just looks so darn cool!

[recursion87]

In a similar place as Foreshadowing Peanuts. Any update on when we could begin to expect asset positioning for tokens/ base-as-center tokens would be great.

On the subject, would FG consider support for spritesheet-tokens with custom rotation? I'd love the ability to set facing on isometric, but the only way that'd work right is via separate assets for each direction/a sprite sheet with all the facings.

[Tailz Silver Paws]

I have had this problem for a while, which forced me to switch the grid off so it didn't re-size odd-shaped tokens in FG Classic. It is a little disappointing if FG Unity is going to squish tokens into pogs. So I am watching this thread to see how it develops.

[Master Wolf]

Is there any recent advances on isometric tokens?

[Moon Wizard]

Not at this time. To be honest, there hasn't been much demand.

JPG

[Master Wolf]

I made some ideas on https://fgapp.idea.informer.com/ about isometric, there is some demand but people does not use it that much, because is not well supported, and because is not use that much, there is no actions about it :c