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  1. #431

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    Ok, I have produced a document containing things that I have identified about this ruleset from the brief time working with it. This document can be found at:

    https://1drv.ms/w/s!Aikn8YrdS93BiKdj...x_lsg?e=Xudf20

    Looking at the responses on this thread I suspect it will be a while before any response is posted.

    The ruleset seems to be half complete with some basic/essential functionality required for the ruleset to work missing.
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    Rise of the Runelords Pathfinder 1e
    "Some are born to move the world, to live their fantasies
    But most of us just dream about the things we'd like to be."
    Rush - Losing It

    Currently DM'ing
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  2. #432
    Quote Originally Posted by ColinBuckler View Post
    Ok, I have produced a document containing things that I have identified about this ruleset from the brief time working with it. This document can be found at:

    https://1drv.ms/w/s!Aikn8YrdS93BiKdj...x_lsg?e=Xudf20

    Looking at the responses on this thread I suspect it will be a while before any response is posted.

    The ruleset seems to be half complete with some basic/essential functionality required for the ruleset to work missing.
    Thank you and sorry for taking so long to get back to you guys. I will go through your document and discuss with MBM what we can do about the issues and how to prioritize

  3. #433

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    Thank you - happy to demonstrate some of the issues if needed.
    Ultimate License
    UK Time Zone (GMT/BST)
    DM'ing since 1977 (Basic D&D)
    Currently Playing:
    Storm King's Thunder 5E Campaign
    Tales from the Yawning Portal 5E Campaign
    Rise of the Runelords Pathfinder 1e
    "Some are born to move the world, to live their fantasies
    But most of us just dream about the things we'd like to be."
    Rush - Losing It

    Currently DM'ing
    Princes of the Apocalypse 5E Campaign
    Waterdeep: Mad Mage 5E Campaign
    Ghosts of Saltmarsh 5E Campaign
    The Blight 5E Campaign

  4. #434

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    Any update on when these issues may be looked at as its been almost a week?
    Ultimate License
    UK Time Zone (GMT/BST)
    DM'ing since 1977 (Basic D&D)
    Currently Playing:
    Storm King's Thunder 5E Campaign
    Tales from the Yawning Portal 5E Campaign
    Rise of the Runelords Pathfinder 1e
    "Some are born to move the world, to live their fantasies
    But most of us just dream about the things we'd like to be."
    Rush - Losing It

    Currently DM'ing
    Princes of the Apocalypse 5E Campaign
    Waterdeep: Mad Mage 5E Campaign
    Ghosts of Saltmarsh 5E Campaign
    The Blight 5E Campaign

  5. #435
    damned's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColinBuckler View Post
    Any update on when these issues may be looked at as its been almost a week?
    For a smaller ruleset it might take a month or longer.
    The dev needs to test it. Then identify the location of the issue. Then determine how they will fix it. Then test it. Then submit it. Then it goes to test. Then it goes to live.
    And before all of that the dev needs to actually have some time to start that process.

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  6. #436

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    I know the turn around can take a while - just asking for an update.

    Last acknowledgement was about referring it to MBM (the developer). Not currently sure if loofou has got in touch with him or even tested to accept the errors need work.

    As an IT Manager who regularly manages large IT projects/development (ex-programmer originally) I appreciate the timescales. Its nice to have acknowledgement that the problem has been received and added to the issue log. It would also expect to see an issue log as well as an approximate roadmap for any development/fix. Something akin to project status, project next expected release/update/patch ...etc date. There does not seem to be any evidence of that. If I could check my problems against a known issue log then I would not need to report the same issue again ....

    I suspect the dev is working on other projects that may well bring in more royalties (Traveller? - The Great Rift just being released) and existing rulesets that are not providing as much revenue being left in the basement so to speak. With the ruleset being somewhat broken, I would always direct my staff working on LIVE systems to fix anything that is broken ahead of any future development as this maintains business as usual. i.e. in this case people can run games or continue to run games with the ruleset.

    Additionally, regardless of the player base, the ruleset is a product sold by Smite Works and my sales contract is with Smite Works and not with any 3rd party developer. The product is marketed as a working ruleset released in 2017 (looking at the store page) - if the product is being sold I would expect it to work certainly after over 3 years - excepting the odd bug here and there (after all nothing can ever really be bug free and fixing a bug may well introduce more than it fixes... LOL).

    For me as a recent product owner of the ruleset and a Smite Works user since 2014 I really wanted this ruleset to work, and is turning out to be a bit of disappointment as its clearly not up to the normal level that I have come to expect from a normal Smite Works product. I am not after the bells and whistles, just a ruleset where I can roll the correct check to determine if a hit has succeeded and then apply the damage. Also if the additional products lineup NPC configuration (Xenomorphs/Trailblazer) would line up with the ruleset. Whilst I have not delved into the product in any real depth these facts make the products unusable and I can manage other stuff that are missing (there are no NPC's/bestiary in the product Appendix 2 Alien & Foes for starters).

    Whilst that sounds like a moan ... I guess it was a bit - sorry - they say moaning is good for the soul....

    All I would like is an acknowledgement that the dev has the issues and roughly when he plan to work on them - be that he is currently working on them or it will be next week or next month.... etc

    Oh and a project status + known issue log (pretty please..!)
    Ultimate License
    UK Time Zone (GMT/BST)
    DM'ing since 1977 (Basic D&D)
    Currently Playing:
    Storm King's Thunder 5E Campaign
    Tales from the Yawning Portal 5E Campaign
    Rise of the Runelords Pathfinder 1e
    "Some are born to move the world, to live their fantasies
    But most of us just dream about the things we'd like to be."
    Rush - Losing It

    Currently DM'ing
    Princes of the Apocalypse 5E Campaign
    Waterdeep: Mad Mage 5E Campaign
    Ghosts of Saltmarsh 5E Campaign
    The Blight 5E Campaign

  7. #437

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    If your expecting any timely responses, you need to look over the thread. This rule set is in the category of "It will get fixed, when it gets fixed!" I bought it in 2017, five years ago and it has never been up to the standards of other rule sets. I even tried to become a developer to get it fixed, but sadly, I do not have the skills to become a programmer or coder. Loofou has moved it further along, of late, and I applaud him for the attempt, but in reality this rule set is still in the you get what you got stage.

    Just take a look at where it is in the forums, under the Core section! If a new purchaser wanted to find information about it, searching the forums is the only option. What does that tell you? Why do I care? After five years I still have hope it will get fixed, not because of the money, but because I like the system. I will probably get flamed by this, but I really don't care. The product is and has been dead for five years, don't expect anything!!

    My apologies,

  8. #438

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    Quote Originally Posted by Viper007 View Post
    If your expecting any timely responses, you need to look over the thread. This rule set is in the category of "It will get fixed, when it gets fixed!" I bought it in 2017, five years ago and it has never been up to the standards of other rule sets. I even tried to become a developer to get it fixed, but sadly, I do not have the skills to become a programmer or coder. Loofou has moved it further along, of late, and I applaud him for the attempt, but in reality this rule set is still in the you get what you got stage.

    Just take a look at where it is in the forums, under the Core section! If a new purchaser wanted to find information about it, searching the forums is the only option. What does that tell you? Why do I care? After five years I still have hope it will get fixed, not because of the money, but because I like the system. I will probably get flamed by this, but I really don't care. The product is and has been dead for five years, don't expect anything!!

    My apologies,
    Its the fact that I have purchased the ruleset expecting a certain level of functionality such as rolling attacks against an enemy and they just don't work. Additionally damage type isn't rolled correctly. The crazy thing is they damage type/roll to hit appears to use the same field. Immunity does appear to work either. Looking at the way the NPC's are setup in the other Xenomorph and Trailblazer products these are the same.

    I don't know how this passed any form of quality control.

    I would look at the ruleset and see if I could spot anything but the entire ruleset is locked away in the vault granting no access to the code, even though I believe you can not copyright game mechanics (I could easily be wrong). I have 19 rulesets installed - 18 of them are available in the ruleset folder all except 1 - and that would be WOIN... All of these rulesets I can unzip and explore/debug - except WOIN.

    Is anybody running a WOIN game - if so how?

    Its all very disappointing.
    Ultimate License
    UK Time Zone (GMT/BST)
    DM'ing since 1977 (Basic D&D)
    Currently Playing:
    Storm King's Thunder 5E Campaign
    Tales from the Yawning Portal 5E Campaign
    Rise of the Runelords Pathfinder 1e
    "Some are born to move the world, to live their fantasies
    But most of us just dream about the things we'd like to be."
    Rush - Losing It

    Currently DM'ing
    Princes of the Apocalypse 5E Campaign
    Waterdeep: Mad Mage 5E Campaign
    Ghosts of Saltmarsh 5E Campaign
    The Blight 5E Campaign

  9. #439
    You are right in some way as WOIN seems to be of a lower priority for SmiteWorks as other, more lucrative, rulesets, but I can also only guess here. I personally am only involved in WOIN but I am also not allowed to touch the code, I can only help in managing the project (and for free I might add).

    About the management aspect: We have an internal Trello board, but we will not make this public. I agree that it would help in estimating when features or updates are coming, but in my years as a community manager I also learned that the opposite can be quite true and as soon as people see some kind of progress they expect that work is done instantaneous or start arguing about priorities.

    Therefore we keep it closed for now. The recent bugs, also those from the document, have been entered and will be worked on as soon as MBM has time for it. WOIN is unfortunately not the only ruleset he works on, but he is the only developer on WOIN at this point.

    Another thing to keep in mind is that this year has been a bit rough on everyone. We couldn't keep up the early momentum unfortunately as life got in the way. There has been a couple of months with nearly no progress, but we started to discuss the next steps and start working on it a few weeks ago, so I assume we will get some updates out soonish (meaning hopefully in the next month, but we are not sure yet). The big FG update in February breaking a lot of features certainly didn't help.

    We are also trying to talk to SW to maybe open up the ruleset a bit more, but it's a matter of contracts and licenses, so we have to see about that.

    I know it's not the best of situations, but we are trying our best to get WOIN back on the road and maintained.

  10. #440
    ddavison's Avatar
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    Hello ColinBuckler,

    The expectations you have for this product are beyond the scope of what it is likely to ever be. Automation of any kind is something that we try to add to rulesets where possible, but the amount of automation and what form it takes is highly dependent upon the popularity of the underlying ruleset and the team/developer assigned to develop it. The WOIN ruleset is a very simple ruleset that includes the full rules of the game and allows you to track and look up information during gameplay without the need for a PDF or hardcover copy of the original rules. Being built on Fantasy Grounds means that you get the common functionality to share and work with images from the source material, move and track tokens, etc. The Combat Tracker has been modified to track the information pertinent to this game system.

    Bugs should be reported and fixed on products we support. Game breaking bugs or those that throw error messages will be prioritized and cosmetic bugs will be added to a list to be addressed with any game breaking bugs. Requests for more automation are welcomed and will be added to a list for consideration as New Feature Requests. Looking at the list you submitted in the first post, it appears that they are cosmetic bugs or feature requests.

    To make things easier for us to track, we also encourage you to list the actual items directly in the forum post instead of linking to an external source. We link to forum posts within our bug tracking system and it makes it easier for us to track specific items.


    I did add these items to our Bug Tracker system for the product:
    1. [Medium] Modifier buttons in the modifier window do not work
    2. [Medium] Not reporting all effects in the combat tracker (if more than one)
    3. [Low] Alignment issue in combat tracker heading
    4. [Low] Show NPC icon on combat tracker alignment issue
    5. [Low] New Feature Requests: (see below)

    List of features requested by user for consideration:
    1. Attack roll vs Defense type has mixed functionality
    2. Damage is untyped
    3. Natural Damage is not populated on NPCs
    4. Automation when Dragging Career to PC (attribute bonuses, roll age or add age, list of skills, calculate number of careers)
    5. Building Custom Attacks - functionality

    The feature requests are items that may not be addressed, but they have been noted and documented.
    Last edited by ddavison; May 11th, 2021 at 14:54.

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