DLR graphic resources

[Topdecker]

The inset, blurry image is what you see in Fantasy Grounds in the Marshall's Guide. The crisp, readable material is what you get if you pay $4 for just the campaign map from a PDF vendor.



Am I wrong to want a legible map?


Tim

[Trenloe]

I think you need to compare apples-with-apples. If you purchased the Marshal's Handbook in PDF that is the exact quality of the map that you will get on page 172 of the PDF.

Now, if you'd paid $4 for a FG module that was just the campaign map (as you have for that PDF you mention) and it wasn't the same quality then you'd have a right to complain. Fantasy Grounds is giving you the same quality as Pinnacle gave them in their digital product.

The Marshal's Handbook FG module gives you the same quality image as you'd get with the Marshal's Handbook PDF. If you have an issue, I suggest you take it up with Pinnacle, not with Smiteworks who are just converting what they are given by the publisher.

To compare apples-with-apples, here's a screenshot of page 172 in my PDF:

[Topdecker]

I am not banging on Smiteworks - this is Pinnacles product line. You guys can only work with what you are given AND the campaign map is a very recent release by Pinnacle. Even so...

The Guide to the Sword Coast compared to this is an apples to apples comparison. Both are digital FG products that detail campaign settings. One has an immense, easily readable map that might actually be so large as to be troublesome and the other is much smaller and far less detailed yet has words on it that you can only guess about.

Comparing a VTT to a PDF is an apples to oranges comparison. All you are saying is that the source material was a PDF and that Pinnacle has not provided any improved graphics - which they certainly have and are happy to sell.

Anyhow, that map can and should be legible and not as a new product. That shouldn't even be a debate item.


Tim

[Talyn]

Part of it depends on the image quality that gets put into the module. We're encouraged to use .jpg as much as possible and crank down the quality to decrease file size since there's a high possibility the GM may share the image with his players... blah blah, yadda yadda. I've seen some downright horrible, blocky, pixelated images that were never that bad in the PDF version (part of the project I'm currently revamping had that issue in several places). Most of the problematic images I see are in older FG products, possibly from the pre-SmiteWorks era (again, such as the one I'm working on now). No clue where DLR fits into that mix or if the two guys who work on it now were the original conversion guys or not.

Now, if it's a matter of "hey [insert publisher here] put out a separate map pack PDF" well, that's another PDF the conversion author has to buy (most of us are freelancers and this stuff isn't freely given to us) which could drive up the price of the FG module...

But I'll shoot a message to the guys and let them know there's a concern over some image quality.

[Trenloe]

Comparing a VTT to a PDF is an apples to oranges comparison. All you are saying is that the source material was a PDF and that Pinnacle has not provided any improved graphics - which they certainly have and are happy to sell.

And, my comparision is completely valid - these are both digital products sold for the same price and the FG module is a direct conversion of the PDF Marshal's Handbook. You aren't getting a worse quality map than anyone who buys the same product (the Marhal's Handbook) in PDF format gets. The improved map is a separate product that is sold for $2.99 - so, to get the Marshal's Handbook in PDf and the high quality map in PDF you need to buy two products for a total of $12.98 - not one product.

Anyhow, that map can and should be legible and not as a new product. That shouldn't even be a debate item.

Take it to Pinnacle instead of going on about it here. I'm sure that Smiteworks would be happy to include the higher resolution map in the Marshal's Handbook module if Pinnacle are willing to give away for free something that they sell in PDF format for $2.99 - because you don't get that $2.99 Map PDF included for nothing when you buy the Marshal's Handbook PDF for $9.99.

Currently these are two separate products - the $2.99 high quality map is not available on Fantasy Grounds, and if it was I would guess that it would sell for the same price as the PDF.

As I said, take it to Pinnacle, it will be them who make the decision as to whether they will provide an updated map for the Marshal's Handbook or whether they want to keep it as a separate product.

EDIT: The MAP PDF is actually $2.99 and available here: https://www.peginc.com/store/deadlan...-west-map-pdf/

[Topdecker]

Talyn -

Hey, thanks, I appreciate it and the explanation. I am also a guy with a poor uplink speed, so I also appreciate images that are small as possible without giving up too much quality. This map is sort of important as the rest of product line refers to locations on this map.

Tim

[Topdecker]

As I said, take it to Pinnacle, it will be them who make the decision as to whether they will provide an updated map for the Marshal's Handbook or whether they want to keep it as a separate product.

Hopefully they can provide the higher quality map and provide something legible for the existing product.

I would like to mention something. DrivethruRPG reports the Marshall's book as having a total of 160 pages. Your map was at page 172 with more pages following, which probably means that your copy is formated as an explorer's version. If so, then your source images are probably worse than someone with the standard version because your source is a smaller paper size. I think you can see where I am heading...

Tim

[Trenloe]

I think you can see where I am heading...

Well, unless you've got a copy of that $9.99 PDF to prove that it is superior quality, I guess we won't know. Because I'm not going to spend $9.99 to continue this inane argument. Take it up with Pinnacle.

Oh, I almost forgot - you can always extract the high quality map image from your separate PDF map product yourself and put that into your Fantasy Grounds campaign. BOOM! You've a nice high quality map in Fantasy Grounds.

[phantomwhale]

Actually the original module conversion was done before that map ever existed.

When the map was later created and made available for free, I added that into the extension. This was around the time the second edition came out, and I did all the updates for that all. As noted, the map was also made available as a $2.99 premium download option also.

As Trenloe notes, this is Pinnacle's choice on how they sell this product. I cannot add the high-quality map into the Deadlands Marshal handbook module, as it doesn't come with the Marshal handbook. I actually don't have a copy of that map at all in my PDF copy, I presume it's been added to later editions (as my second edition PDFs were probably made before the map existed) but again, only in the lower-resolution format.

Now, we could make a $2.99 FG module with the high-res map... but given that's just an image, it seems better to just let GMs import that image themselves into their own campaigns. Although you are quite right to mention uplink speed issues - I think I once tried to share the full-res map with my DLR players, and it flooded my uplink (killing off any useful teamspeak chat from me) for over 20 minutes. Good to plan that one around a tea-break...

I'd love to be able to offer the high-quality map as part of the product. Perhaps Smiteworks / Pinnacle could work something out? You can contact Smiteworks direct on [email protected] if you want to contact them directly (or they might chip in here !) But given Pinnacles decision to have that map as a high-resolution premium add-on, it might not be possible to do something like that in the FG world.