Underwater Combat and Spell Casting

[Baron28]

You are a spell caster under water and attempt to cast a spell that has a verbal component. Is this possible? If so below are possible adjudications:

A
1. Roll a DC 15 check for the spell. The check is the ability for that spell or your class.
2. If you succeed, cast the spell as normal.
3. You fail, cast the spell at disadvantage.

B
1. Roll a DC 15 check for the spell. The check is the ability for that spell or your class.
2. If you succeed, cast the spell at disadvantage
3. You fail, the spell fails.

C.
1. Spells casting that requires a verbal component while underwater is not possible.

Thoughts?

[Griogre]

D: Who hasn't yelled underwater? I let them cast normally, but I may alter the spell AoE, and penalize fire spells. Basically use the yes, but ... this works differently underwater. Caster's don't get that many spells and you don't want to hose them any more than anyone else who is not aquatic in underwater combat, IMO. Don't give them a free pass but they shouldn't be penalize more either.

Alternatively, the check mechanic is not a bad idea, I would make it a concentration check instead though if that wasn't what you meant.

[LordEntrails]

I was going to say C. But then I saw D...

I agree that spell casters should not be penalized more than any other class when fighting/acting underwater. On that basis, and since I have no idea what the rules on underwater combat are, I'd just go with that theme/idea.

[Baron28]

D: Who hasn't yelled underwater? I let them cast normally, but I may alter the spell AoE, and penalize fire spells. Basically use the yes, but ... this works differently underwater. Caster's don't get that many spells and you don't want to hose them any more than anyone else who is not aquatic in underwater combat, IMO. Don't give them a free pass but they shouldn't be penalize more either.

Alternatively, the check mechanic is not a bad idea, I would make it a concentration check instead though if that wasn't what you meant.

D was the adjudication last session, but I feel that being underwater should make the casting spells with a verbal component more difficult than if they were on dry land. Altering AoE and penalizing fire spells is a good idea. Agreed that Option C would be harsh, but maybe a Wizard has to man up and be a meat shield. Option A is less harsh than Option B because at least there is no auto fail. By the way, the check mechanic is not on concentration but on the spell casting ability.

I like Option A adding your altering AoE and penalizing fire spells (Resistant to Fire), but it would be fun to see a Wizard take on a Giant Crayfish with a dagger or a quarterstaff.

[Baron28]

I was going to say C. But then I saw D...

I agree that spell casters should not be penalized more than any other class when fighting/acting underwater. On that basis, and since I have no idea what the rules on underwater combat are, I'd just go with that theme/idea.

PHB pg. 198 The 4 paragraphs detail melee (DISATK unless simple weapon) and ranged attacks (Auto Miss beyond normal range. At normal range DISATK unless crossbow, a net or a thrown weapon (javelin, trident, spear, dart). Resistant to Fire Damage. There is nothing about casting spells underwater.

[damned]

D was the adjudication last session, but I feel that being underwater should make the casting spells with a verbal component more difficult than if they were on dry land. Altering AoE and penalizing fire spells is a good idea. Agreed that Option C would be harsh, but maybe a Wizard has to man up and be a meat shield. Option A is less harsh than Option B because at least there is no auto fail. By the way, the check mechanic is not on concentration but on the spell casting ability.

I like Option A adding your altering AoE and penalizing fire spells (Resistant to Fire), but it would be fun to see a Wizard take on a Giant Crayfish with a dagger or a quarterstaff.

You are the boss! Be prepared for the Wizard to try and penalise her teammates on their underwater actions next though! If you can imagine it an describe it and it makes sense in your head - run with it. Id penalise a lot more than just fire spells though... electrical attacks would also be very interesting...

[jshauber]

I would rule that if they are capable of breathing underwater, then they can cast normally.

Otherwise, I like the check method and apply some penalty based on level of failure.

[Callum]

For reference, none of the previous editions of D&D placed a restriction on casting spells underwater, whether or not they had a verbal component. AD&D had a list of spells that wouldn't function underwater, while 2nd Edition generalised from this list to say that fire-based spells, those affecting forces of nature (eg call lightning) and those that summon or control non-underwater creatures had no effect, while electrical spells conducted into the surrounding water (changing a lightning bolt into an electrical fireball, for example). 3E required you to make a Spellcraft check (DC 20 + spell level) to make a spell with the fire descriptor effective underwater, and line of effect was blocked for those spells by the surface of a body of water.

[TamarValleyPete]

For my money...If it has a verbal component, the spell will require breath. If you can breathe underwater all well and good. If you cannot, still all well and good...except, you are going to run out of breath! So, casting a single action spell, no problem. Casting 2, well I think that is a hard fortitude save. Casting 3, a very hard fortitude save! Casting 4, you better be a god.

[Fear Grounds]

For my money...If it has a verbal component, the spell will require breath. If you can breathe underwater all well and good. If you cannot, still all well and good...except, you are going to run out of breath! So, casting a single action spell, no problem. Casting 2, well I think that is a hard fortitude save. Casting 3, a very hard fortitude save! Casting 4, you better be a god.

This!!!

Spells like water breathing allow complete casting to players, but shows that there had to be at least some preparation before diving into the water.

Not to mention there are species that can hold their breath indefinitely, or exceptionally long periods of time.

This puts spell casters way ahead of melee combatants, that can now only use simple weapons effectively. If they even have these (typically seen as lesser/weaker) weapons available to use. Though it can be argued that spells like freedom of movement could allow full use of any weapon under water.

I would also add that if a character does not have a swim speed, any attacks should be at disadvantage, since the character has to actively try not to drown(if they can't breath under water of course).